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China launches own aircraft engine-maker to rival the West

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China already makes its own planes, but has struggled for decades to develop engines that meet global requirements. (www.bbc.com) المزيد...

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N8101
Lee Smith 3
Tim, Your words: Copy Cats and product reliability and longevity. Says it all.
vanstaalduinenj
Jon Van Staalduinen 2
And it begins....should I be teaching my kids to speak Chinese????
N750CX
Clarke Ramsey 2
Make sure you teach them to say. "Mayday, Mayday, Mayday!"

[This poster has been suspended.]

vanstaalduinenj
Jon Van Staalduinen 1
Good question.....14 cents and hour vs 24 Dollars an hour....mmmm..... let's think about this for a bit....
SmokedChops
SmokedChops 2
correct me if I am wrong here...but isn't AVIC the parent company of Continental Motors. They built knock-offs of the Klimov engines for years, not too big of a stretch to start from scratch. (if scratch is where they actually started.)
tcmarks
Tim Marks 3
The Chinese rarely start anything from scratch. They are the greatest copy cats in the world and have reverse engineered and pilfered technology from everyone else to get where they are today. Many foreign companies have 'partnered' with them in joint ventures over the years, with promises of big money, only to be divested from the JV when the Chinese government decided enough knowledge has been 'shared' with them. Problem is all of the unwritten and unspoken knowledge needed to apply the 'borrowed' information did not come with it and the Chinese will be at the low end of the spectrum for product reliability and longevity.
caltankoo
Calvin Chan 0
I'll ask you very simple logic questions, Would you invent compass now to create the birth of navigation, P.S. don't tell me there is now GPS or satellite technology substitute compass who cares about compass now blah blah blah, who will know navigation today if compass was not been invented, and how did the Chinese navigate across the seas at least a thousand year ago or could even be a couple thousands year ago] wouldn't now all the Chinese became sea creatures if compass wasn't invented that time to navigate them back to the land ? Would you also like to invent printing because someone else has made it easier for you to copy words? All comes to one point Why waste the time the money and the brainpower to design / invent something from ground zero which already been invented and made successfully by someone regardless of the nation/culture? What if we all repeat someone's very first step, and so We humans be starting from the ancient times inventing tools and then your Homo sapiens friend has to reinvent the same tools again and so as others so forth. In the end, Not much else can be made as time wasted on inventing tools! What's remaining is just the damn TOOLS!

AS to your prejudice comment on the Chinese is stealing everyone's design to make for their own Are the rest of other cultures and nations free from pilfering design, technology, invention in the past and present, and so to be in a position to criticize and stereotype Chinese? You are right about the Chinese pilfering designs from other countries, but the fact is if you would search on the history archives, the German (Nazi) were first to build a the world's first operational jet engine that put on a fighter called Messerschmitt Me 262 and successfully flew before the end of WWII, if you like it or not about the fact. But guess what after the war when western nations found the Germans had jet-powered aircrafts, weren't they also pilfered and copy cat the blueprint and the actual jet engine from the Nazi figher for understanding about jet propulsion and reverse engineered the original design to be able to provide more thrust for powering the heavier commercial airliners in the 50s? How does the flying wing design of the B2 bomber come from? Copy cat from the design of WWII German Horten 229. And towards now, Western just revolutionized the way of printing of laser, plasma printing, 3D printing etc, but whichever of that the concept of printing remained the same as from the Chinese built world's first printing machine back around 650-670 AD

I don't see copying is such a concern as the way you look at. It is not an uncommon corporate practice nowadays. Just to name a few examples, smartphone companies copying each other's innovative products to stay competitiveness. In aviation, aircraft makers are moving to the use of composite materials on modern airliners. Copying is just one of the natural instincts born with us as humans and even on animals. As we infants learn to walk, parents don't write or say instructions to teach us, because infants do not have knowledge base to be able to interpret, read and understand spoken words. All they do is copy from the parents try and error and eventually able to walk independently. With respect to that, the reason that Chinese are making huge progress on commercial utilities and military equipment, greatly acquiring knowledge through copying , even you are assuming that Chinese is short of unwritten and unspoken pilfered information, reverse engineering would make the problem solved. Chinese are not embarrassed to be called copy cat, as some nations like to accuse others are the only true copy cat with history proofs. In future China is really able to climb up the upper end and the top of the spectrum for quality, reliability and longevity. I can assure this message once and for all of you prejudice, racist, and anti-Chinese believers. You guys are big lairs as well
fastroper
Cecil Clark 1
China already owns almost every major American General Aviation manufacturer. If you're buying a new Cessna, Beechcraft (both now Textron), Cirrus, or Mooney, you're buying a Chinese product now. Chinese are also buying up aviation parts and service companies like Continental Engines, Superior Air parts, Thielert diesel engines and others. They are actively working to take over not only US aviation companies, but European as well. Bad Juju.
N8101
Lee Smith 1
The story is short on facts and plans, But!! I wonder what is really up there, chop sticks for the future. The government always has a plan for its actions, just like building the bases off the coast on the remote islands.
caltankoo
Calvin Chan 1
just like your government militarizing five oceans and almost seven continents?
ToddBaldwin3
ToddBaldwin3 1
I worry about things manufactured in China. Their approach to quality control is that it's a test that has to be passed (by whatever means) rather than a measure of the quality of their product (remember the melamine added to dog food and infant formula to artificially boost the protein value).

[This poster has been suspended.]

tcmarks
Tim Marks 1
Peter, are you going to fly on a Chinese airliner with Chinese engines - built from technologies learned/borrowed/stolen from the industrial countries that invented these technologies? That is point of the below conversation how China did not invent any of the technologies they are using to build aircraft and engines.

One fine example is the ARJ21 airliner - it is a DC9 / Fokker 100 in content and design - that is 10 years behind the original EIS date and more than 15 years in development. This is due the inability to sort out the 'tribal knowledge' of the aviation technologies that did not come along with the learned/borrowed/stolen knowledge being used to build and manufacture this plane. This was their first attempt.

Their second attempt, the C919, is going a little better since the French have been helping them build a copy of an A319 (anyone seeing a link in the designators here?). Only been in development for 8 years now with a promise of deliveries in 2018.

Neither of these aircraft would be flying if not for western engines under the wings/on the tail - and yes they are being built in China so this knowledge can be 'learned' before killing these joint ventures in the future. The Chinese are smart enough/criminal enough to get their information from everyone else to short the learning curve, but when it comes to high technologies they have missed the boat. Without the learning curve the unwritten/unspoken knowledge is not there and they will be floundering for many more years before they can figure it out.

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